Ogyen Trinley Dorje in his own words

Dear readers,

During China’s Billionaire Karmapa recent visit to Paris Ponlop Rinpoche’s brother, Dilyak Drupon, allowed him to speak to a journalist.

This happened.

I submit it for your consideration.

He didn’t share his thoughts on his recent collaboration with the Chinese Government to guarantee that we in the West have seen our last Traleg Rinpoche who is not a creature of the Chinese Government.

Nothing on the Panama Papers either.

His labrang is up to his neck in that business.

There are some interesting insights to be had into his thinking on China.

What he didn’t say speaks volumes.

The same can be said of his thoughts on why Tibetans no longer see a future for themselves in India.

He thinks being Karmapa is hard.

Spoken like a true billionaire.

Bill

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13 Comments

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13 responses to “Ogyen Trinley Dorje in his own words

  1. Anitra

    Bill, you might be granted permission to do an equivalent interview with HHGK when he visits Canada in the autumn. DPR is the point person for the trip- reach out to him. Shoot, Lion’s Roar might even be interested in publishing it. You do know you have a pretty strong following.

    🙂

  2. Jackie

    Let’s be fair to your Karmapa; he wasn’t asked the questions you want answered.

    • Nate

      Nah, maybe he is the rich spoiled shit stain that Bill seems to think he is.

      However you look at it, it’s very easy to criticize a young Tibetan reincarnation of the Karmapa from the safety of one’s living room. I imagine that if Bill spend 20 minutes in Karmapa’s shoes he would be much, much more empathetic.

      • Nate,

        We have seen our last Traleg Rinpoche that isn’t a creature of China’s government thanks to Ogyen Trinley Dorje.

        This is who he is to me, not what you think he is to me.

        I visualize Ogyen Trinley Dorje upon the crown of my head.

        Daily.

        This is how I spend my days, doing ngondro.

        This is my thing.

        Blessed be the disciple that suffers their guru.

        I’m glad you are so happy with what Ogyen Trinley Dorje has done.

        Bill

    • Jackie,

      We have seen our last Traleg Rinpoche that isn’t a creature of China’s government thanks to Ogyen Trinley Dorje.

      I will not rest until he is answered for this.

      Bill

  3. Sara

    What a pragmatic young man!

    • Sara,

      How about the Panama Papers?

      How about his collaborating with China’s occupation?

      Nothing.

      He’s a Karmapa.

      He’s the leader of the Karma Kagyu sect.

      That he is a pragmatic young man is irrelevant.

      Bill

  4. Jane

    I don’t think you will get any answers to your questions until you write Karmapa a letter. Have you tried?

    • Jane,

      My question is not for him but you, myself included.

      Dare we speak truth to power?

      Bill

      • Dave

        Hmmm. I think that your sights are misplaced, big man. If anyone is deserving of questioning it would be Thrangu Rinpoche and His Holiness Dalai Lama. It seems that the Dalai Lama signed off on the Karmapa’s rise to dual recognition (Tibetan and Chinese). I can see how the Tibetan Government in Exile may very well have thought that a Karmapa supported by China would signal a sea change as it were in relation to general Sino-Tibetan relations.

        As such one could even suggest that HHGK is a Frankenstein conceived of by Thrangu Rinpoche and signed off by the Tibetans as an experiment. In the end the Geluks also stood to gain in that the Kagyu were so irreconcilably split, thus maintaining their centuries of general hegemony as far as Tibetan cultural power dynamics is concerned; a split that goes back to Choying Dorje and the Great 5th Dalai Lama (as the instigation of Desi Sangye Dorje- the 5th Dalai Lama’s Regent).

        So, blaming HHGK is like blaming the result, not the causal factors.

        Time is of the essence here. Akong Rinpoche, the lama charged with finding Karmapa is dead. A portion of the story died with him. Thrangu Rinpoche is very old, and when he dies much of the truth behind the story will die with him. This leaves the Dalai Lama and Situpa as the last two major Tibetan players. I think the rest of the Kagyu leadership just hedged their bets based on outcome. Kongtrul may have killed himself when he realized what was happening, and Shamar, ever the modern independent thinker advanced an alternative candidate, smelling the politics involved. It’s ironic that the supporters of OTD smeared Shamar as the political lama, and even more ironic that the label stuck.

        But I ask you, what was HHDL thinking? His advisors as well? Thrangu Rinpoche is quite literally a Kagyu version of Trijang Rinpoche- an orthodox arch conservative. His reasoning makes sense, and yet still reprehensible.

        I would put the heat on those two, they represent the worst as far as shameless politicking goes…

        • Dave,

          I apologize if I was not clear on this point.

          Ogyen Trinley Dorje is responsible for collaborating with the Chinese Government for his guaranteeing that we have seen the last Traleg Rinpoche that is not China’s creature.

          This is on him, Ogyen Trinley Dorje.

          Up until last year I had held out hope that His Holiness would balk at doing so, go against Thrangu Rinpoche on doubling down on Rinpoche’s disastrous decision over thirty years ago to collaborate with the Chinese Government to make yet another child the creature of China that Thrangu Rinpoche made of him as a child.

          I still can’t quite get my mind around how after all Ogyen Trinley Dorje went through as a child that His Holiness went “Stockholm Syndrome” on us and condemned another child to the same fate he suffered as a child, being a creature of China’s government for life.

          To summarize, the Karma Kagyu sect is guilty of collaborating with the Chinese government to guarantee that we have seen the last Karmapa that is not a creature of China.

          If Thaye Dorje is your Karmapa this obviously doesn’t apply to you of course thanks to Shamar Rinpoche and his line of succession which maintains that the Karmapa and Shamarpa are equals, as such, which we thankfully have to fall back on if the Dalai Lama asks Ogyen Trinley Dorje to step down as head of the Karma Kagyu sect.

          Secondly, the Karma Kagyu sect is without question guilty of collaborating with the Chinese Government to guarantee that we have seen the last Trungpa Rinpoche that is not China’s creature for life.

          This is totally on the Karma Kagyu sect thanks to Situ Rinpoche whom when he was in Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s shoes, he too was in his thirties at the time, doubled down on Thrangu Rinpoche’s decision to collaborate with China’s genocidal occupation of Tibet.

          Talk about the dark side of succession by reincarnation, the power Thrangu Rinpoche has to this day over the young men he made his creatures for life as children, there you have it.

          It’s obscene if you drill down into it as a subject the power this man has had over the Karma Kagyu sect since the passing of the 16th Karmapa in 1981.

          And finally, as stated above, that we have seen the last Traleg Rinpoche that is not a creature of China’s government for life is on Ogyen Trinley Dorje, with the caveat that he did so thanks to the influence Thrangu Rinpoche has over him as the man who made him who he is today, a creature of China’s government for life.

          Bill

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