For Western Buddhists, thanks to the Panama Papers, Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim to be 17th Karmapa is henceforth null and void

As a lama of the 16th Karmapa’s mahasiddha inspired crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu lineage here in the United States of America I hereby challenge Ogyen Trinley Dorje to answer for his use of the same law firm used by members of the Chinese Communist Party, as documented in the Panama Papers, to hide money he has received from supporters of said dictatorship contrary to his previous claim after being charged in 2008 by the Indian government with violating its laws governing foreign currency that he was committed to financial transparency.

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50 responses to “For Western Buddhists, thanks to the Panama Papers, Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim to be 17th Karmapa is henceforth null and void

  1. Nyonya

    Bwahahahahaha.

    Okay, next….

    • Earlier this year Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s was caught doing what he said he wasn’t doing in 2008 when he claimed to be financial transparent after being charged by India for violating its laws governing foreign currency.

      He lied, and as a lama I am calling him out on this lies, he’s done in America, stick a fork in his claim that he was the 17th Karmapa.

      This is not who we are as American Buddhists.

      Ogyen Trinley Dorje is bought and paid for by supporters of the Chinese Communist Party, and thanks to the Panama Papers, there is no denying this fact.

  2. Warrenz

    Lama BIll for Karmapa! Make the Karma Kagyu great again!!

    • In 2016 anyone can just visit my Twitter feed to see that I am no ethno-nationalist, good luck with anyone who wishes to characterize my calling upon my fellow Buddhists in America to consider Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim to be 17th Karmapa null and void here in the United States of America.

      Like my fellow Bernie Sanders voters I stand for transparency, inclusiveness, and accountability, I stand against dictatorship, as it pertains to Ogyen Trinley Dorje, the Chinese Communist Party, that which the Karma Kagyu sect, long before globalization normalized dictatorship as a legitimate form of governance, while the Cold War was still a thing during the 1980’s did knowingly collaborated with to make Ogyen Trinley Dorje 17th Karmapa, and therefore, I call upon all Buddhists in America to consider Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim to be 17th Karmapa null and void in the United States of America as it pertains to any public activity of himself or anyone who represents him as 17th Karmapa in this country, specifically, KTD, its affiliates centers, and in particular, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche as the official representative of Ogyen Trinley Dorje in the United States of America.

      Earlier this year we learned thanks to the Panama Papers that Ogyen Trinley Dorje contrary to his claim after being charged by the Indian Government with violating its law governing foreign currency that he would henceforth be transparent in regards to his finances lied to us, that since prior to being charged with fraud in India to present, Ogyen Trinley Dorje did, and continues to use the very same law firm used by members of the Chinese Communist Party that made him 17th Karmapa to hide money received from supporters of said dictatorship in an offshore account thereby henceforth disqualifying him in the United States of America to represent himself as a Buddhist leader in good standing welcome in our country as such.

  3. Jessi

    Lama Bill Schwartz:

    • I’ve been a lama of the 16th Karmapa’s crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu lineage for years now and in keeping with this tradition I have kept my being so between myself and my guru, Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche, out of respect for his life’s work here in America on behalf of the Karma Kagyu lineage of Tibetan Buddhism, which although I disagree with his politics I remain his disciple, despite his collaborating with the Chinese Communist Party against the interests of my fellow citizens of the United States of America to make Ogyen Trinley Dorje 17th Karmapa, the Chinese Communist Party’s choice for 17th Karmapa.

      As a lama, a Buddhist living in America I can no longer continue to as I have been to date given what Ogyen Trinley Dorje has done, lied to the Buddhists of America about who he is as a Buddhist leader, he told us after the Indian Government charged him with violating its law governing foreign currency while in fact, according to the Panama Papers, he has all along been using the very same law firm used by the Chinese Communist Party to hide money he receives from said dictatorship’s supporters in an offshore account, something which as a lama, as a Buddhist, living in the United States of America in 2016 I must, not just privately here as a blogger blogging for my readers, but as a dharma practitioner publicly call upon my fellow Buddhists in the United States of America to consider Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim to be the 17th Karmapa, a Buddhist teacher in our country, henceforth null and void, and furthermore to publicly hold to his representatives, KTD, its affiliate centers, and Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche as official representatives of Ogyen Trinley Dorje in the United States in particular to account for their actions in their capacity as such.

  4. karma

    I think therapy could help. Your kleshas are consuming you now.

    • We are way beyond such talk as being an effective rebuttal against what Ogyen Trinley Dorje stands accused of having done, lying to us by representing himself as being financially transparent while, according to the Panama Papers, using the same law firm as members of the Chinese Communist Party to hide money from supporters of said dictatorship in an offshore account.

      • karma

        Rather, you are way beyond having any authority or credibility given your consistent use of baseless slander. You are a misguided gossip, running away with wild accusations of conspiracies. Perhaps financial mistakes were made but you are mixing it all up with your personal neurosis and anger issues.

        • You are not the first person to attempt to anonymously attack me here but to date not a single fellow disciple of Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche that I came up with since 1981 here in Chicago, it’s not like these people don’t exist, that you can’t find these people, has publicly spoken out against me or my blog, not a single representative of Ogyen Trinley Dorje, nor his representative in the United States, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, nor KTD and its affiliate centers have either ever publicly taken exception to anything I have ever blogged here over the past four years of this blogs existence which given the popularity of this blog, 93,608 visitors, 441,221 views to date, speaks to what you are up against as a supporter of Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim that he is the 17th Karmapa, and someone to be regarded by the Buddhists of America to be a teacher of Buddhism worthy of our consideration as such.

          What the Panama Papers have documented, that Ogyen Trinley Dorje did use, and continues to do so, the very same law firm used by members of the Chinese Communist Party to hide money he receives from supporters of said dictatorship in an offshore bank account, was no mistake on Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s part, if this was a mistake he has to date issued no apology for what he has done, knowingly lied to us about his finances after being charged by the Indian Government with violating its laws governing foreign currency, nor has his Labrang, Dilyak Drupon Rinpoche, Ponlop Rinpoche’s brother, been removed from his position even though he is the person named by the Panama Papers as the party responsible for opening the offshore account in question.

          • karma

            Ok, simple question. Did the 16th Karmapa rely on and support Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche, Thrangu Rinpoche, and Akong Rinpoche. Answer it plainly.

            • After he died and they were turned by Chen Li-an on behalf of the Chinese Communist Party, which according to Shamar Rinpoche, his nephew whom he without question trusted, is how Ogyen Trinley Dorje became 17th Karmapa, but to answer your question there is no question that they did their best to serve his interests to the best of their abilities, I would never say that he trusted their judgement which were clearly while he was alive contrary to his efforts to establish his lineage in the United States States of America, which I submit for your consideration as an example of this, his going against their judgement, furthermore, regarding Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche he had to, after Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche refused treatment in India for TB, giving away his medicine to other patients at the hospital he was in who couldn’t afford their own medicine which resulted in their death from TB, thanks to Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche’s Judgement, which is how Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche ended up being sent to America, on a medical visa, I could write a book on what he thought of Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche’s judgement, they have a long history together, regarding the others, he trusted Thrangu to discipline members of his household, Situ and Shamar Rinpoches, talk about child endangerment, and of course, last but not least he trusted Akong Rinpoche to keep Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche under control when Chogyam Trungpa was shipped off to Great Britain after knocking up a nun, and we all know how that turned out, so obviously he trusted them after a fashion but not to any government good end, not that any of this is at all relevant to the nullification of Ogyen Trinley Dorje as 17th Karmapa, whether or not we as Buddhists, in light of what we have learned from the Panama Papers, be allowed to teach Buddhism in the United States as he has been allowed to since 2008, without a thorough vetting of his financial relationship with supporters of the Chinese Communist Party, not just in regards to the Kagyu Monlom account and KTD, he needs to account for all his projects in the United States of America moving forward.

  5. Don

    BILL FOR KARMAPA!!!

    • The 16th Karmapa was the last Karmapa of a free Tibet, a fact which in 2016 nobody can argue otherwise, but this being said the 16th Karmapa’s crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu lineage which His Holiness established in the United States of America prior to his passing into Parinirvana here at Zion, Illinois in 1981 lives on in all of my generation of then young dharma practitioners whom continue to this day with the practice he introduced us to so many years ago, Mahamudra, the Mahasiddha inspired teaching of the Karma Kagyu lineage, that which I here today represent as a lama and a Buddhist living in America, opposed to Ogyen Trinley Dorje, the Chinese Communist Party’s choice for 17th Karmapa, and all that he represents to my fellow Buddhists of the United States of America whom I say without fear of contradiction will settle for nothing less than transparency, inclusiveness, and accountability from our leaders without exception, regardless of their position as a Buddhist leader elsewhere.

  6. Dear Dharma friends, Bill might be angry, cantankerous, and a bit controversial, but he is finally on to something here. I understand that many of us have a strong bond to our teachers that should remain intact for our practice, but this is a Dharma bond, not a political one. The candidacy of Ogyen Trinley Dorje rinpoche has been plagued with serious issues right from the very beginning when Situpa and Akong started their coup. Please take an honest and critical look at the whole picture here. If there was a Dharma court OTD would fry, and the money issue would be the least of his problems.

    There is another very serious candidate that is worth a good serious look. He is honest and has never had any questionable interactions with any government. He has a complete transmission from the great 16th and does not operate on any level politically. You know who I mean.

    Think about it.

    And Bill Ryder japhy or whatever you like to be called, I commend you for listening to your instincts and intuition. Keep pushing, you have many good Buddhists behind you. I am one of them and happy to be counted among them.

    Respectfully QP

    • I can’t believe you are still angry about the time I deleted a comment you posted here for being a dick, I’m sorry, I didn’t like the tone of your comment, it was nothing personal, and it was by no means out of anger but the fact that I am as you said, cantankerous, I don’t suffer fools without complaint in the comment section of my blog, in 2014 a total of 6656 comments were posted here, I had much to be cantankerous about here in the past, but again I am nothing if not happy to do what I have done here with this blog over the past years, it has been a pleasure as far as I’m concerned, it has been an incredible run for a free WordPress blog on such an esoteric subject as the Karmapa in America, I never in my wildest dreams thought it would ever be the success it has been and continues to be, I shared here the other day that I’m a lama, I’ve been one for years, and the next day people are talking about it in the cafeteria, to say nothing of my following abroad, and in particular India which this morning went viral over night over this particular blog post.

      • Lama Bill, actually I am not angry at all either. I meant it as a compliment to you. I thought it might empower you, you sometimes seem to have a grumpy sort of quality that my grandfather had. I respected him a lot. I am very happy for your success your efforts deserve nothing less. We all should be happy. The truth can never be wrong. I continue to wish you, even more, success beyond your wildest dreams.

    • Lama tuchi pheely

      OTD would ‘fry’ if he were tried in court?

      QP, or whoever you are, such hyperbole requires just a little explanation, no?

      As for Bill’s assertion that the lack of comment on his blog from Tsurphu Labrang, KTD or Ponlop inherently means they support him sounds far fetched at best. It’s obvious that you are such small potatoes that no one knows, or cares about who you are. As Picasso was famous for saying, “the most effective way of killing someone is by ignoring them”, in relation to the constant harassing letters that Salvador Dali sent him.

      Besides, you have that letter from KKR on your altar that Lama Kathy had sent to you. I’ll bet five bucks that it is not a letter recognizing you as a lama. If anything it says the opposite.

      • I have not argued that Ogyen Trinley Dorje not publicly responding to the Panama Papers has anything to do with this blog, I’m not quite sure how such a wild inference has gotten into this discussion, regardless we are beyond anything said here at this point as it pertains to the Panama Papers, and into the realm of the public record, Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s claim to being 17th Karmapa, specifically whether or not we in the United States of America see fit to allow him to as he has since 2008 to teach Buddhism in our country without answering to our satisfaction how he came to use the same law firm as members of the Chinese Communist Party to hide money he received from supporters of said dictatorship in an offshore bank account, again, a matter of public record which requires no response from Ogyen Trinley Dorje for as long as he remains hunkered down in India incommunicado, but mark my words, if he wishes to do otherwise, to teach Buddhism in the United States of America Ogyen Trinley Dorje must publicly submit to questions regarding his claim after he was charged by the Indian Government with violating its laws governing foreign currency that he was committed to financial transparency in light of what we know thanks to the Panama Papers.

  7. karma

    Actually a main player in the Panama papers issue appears to be Dilyak Drupon Rinpoche. He was recognised as a Tulku by your last true Karmapa. Bill, how is it that the 16th Karmapa was then such a lousy judge of character? How does that sit in all your conspiracy rhetoric?

    http://www.bhutannewsnetwork.com/2016/05/bhutanese-named-in-panama-papers/

    • Marcel

      Word. That cat the 16th was bugging. He reconized Dilyak Drubon, Ponlop, Situ and Shamar and all the others who was all power tripping and destroying our lineage and shit like that.

      Old boy 16th Karmapa sure fucked up a lot picking those clowns and letting them loose on us.

      • Mitchell

        No doubt.

        Snitches be getting stitches and ole 16th Karmapa be fucking shit up big time.

        He reconized all of Tulku Urgyen’s sons too even they be bitch asses.

        What up?

  8. karma

    Show us your letter of recognition as a lama Bill.

    • Danielle

      There isn’t a letter.

      Bill is a natural arising (self-appointed) lama.

    • Ours is an oral lineage is it not?

      • karma

        Yes, except that you keep raising the prediction letter as a construction by Situ Rinpoche, and yet, here you go so easy on your own self appointment.

        • I’m a lama, get over it.

          • karma

            that was definitely more Trump than Sanders.

            • I’m reminded of, this is for those people who don’t now Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche, my guru, as I have come to know him as his disciple since 1981, I’m a founding member of Chicago KTC, and being so ill informed take issue with the fact that for years now I have been a lama of the Mahasiddha inspired crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu lineage, which long story short for our purposes here began with Khenpo Gangshar in Tibet which was transmitted to Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche at Thrangu monastery, along with Thrangu and Trungpa Rinpoches in 1958 on the eve of their flight into exile, as the story goes, in brief I must add, I could write a book on this subject.

              I have for obvious reasons kept that I am a lama to myself over the years, this is between myself and Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche, as is our tradition, which is oral, no person well informed as to my lineages long and storied lineage which dates back to the times of the Indian Mahasiddhas Tilopa, Maitripa and an ill-reputed over reaching ill mannered example of a Tibetan hustler, Marpa, my inspiration as a young man, there was never any question what lineage holder I had chosen to model myself Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche accepted me as his disciple, I say this without fear of anyone in a position to know saying otherwise, to anyone that wants to cast shade on anything I say on this particular subject, good luck with that.

              For ten years, beginning in 1991 Khenpo Karthar put all his eggs in one basket and didn’t visit us here in Chicago so he could focus his efforts exclusively on KTD’s three year retreat at Karme Ling, which when it was all said and done he lived to regret, in Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche’s absence KTC Chicago became Bardor Tulku Rinpoche’s joint, we have in Chicago a generation of people who took refuge with Bardor Tulku Rinpoche, compared to those of us that took refuge with Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche in the 1980’s before he was turned by United Front Work Department of the Chinese Communist Party, which is an incredible story in itself, this was long before globalization normalized the existence of said dictatorship, but I digress.

              So one day this Chinese guy living in Wisconsin dressed in the robes of a KTD lama with students in tow shows up at Chicago KTC to introduce them to Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche and as far as everyone here in Chicago, you can imagine the commotion his sudden appearance in Cicero caused at the time, the guy wasn’t a lama, he was at Karme Ling long enough to walk away with KTD’s robes but dropped out and never completed his retreat, not that it made the least bit of difference to Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche when the matter was brought to his attention by those that wanted the scoundrel unceremoniously thrown out onto the street, but Rinpoche would have none of it and treated him as he treats anyone I have witnessed him do so over the years, with respect, patience, and equanimity, for as I learned from Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche we never really know in our lineage whether someone is as they appear to us to be, the example being the Indian Mahasiddhas that inspired the teachings which Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche transmitted to me as a young man and over the past thirty five years has supervised my practice to this day, very long story short.

              I’m a lama so if you can’t get your head around this fact,deal with it, it’s your problem, I have publicly dropped this knowledge here knowing well that it would cause a stir in the KTD cafeteria, mission accomplished, to focus attention on what is a matter of public record, thanks to Panama Papers, that when Ogyen Trinley Dorje was charged by the Indian Government with violating its law governing foreign currency and he pledged himself to be financially transparent with us, that his being charged a criminal by the Indian Government for hiding millions of dollars in Chinese currency in suitcases in Gyuto Monastery was just a perfectly understandable misunderstanding of the law, Ogyen Trinley Dorje as documented by the Panama Papers straight up lied to the world, which is not something myself, a lama, or my fellow Buddhists of the United States of America will tolerate in a teacher of Buddhism in our country, the rest of the Buddhist world be damned if they are okay with what Ogyen Trinley Dorje was caught doing, we are talking about an ongoing financial fraud dating back to 2017, and we Buddhists here in the United States, imagine if one of us, I’m reminded of the brouhaha that ensued after Ken McLeod was caught mixing his business as a Buddhist teacher with his romantic interest in a female student of his who took offense with his unwanted advances, good for her I might add, did what Ogyen Trinley Dorje has done, and continues to do, hide millions, perhaps even billions of dollars for all we know, from people in Taiwan, Hong Kong, and so on who support the Chinese Communist Party’s aspiration to rebrand its dictatorship as a patron, not just Tibetan Buddhism, but all of Buddhism, against our interests, the interests of every Buddhist living not just in the United States of America but any Buddhist in any democratically organized society, the free world as we no it, again very long story short.

              • Karma

                So you take your title and authority as “lama” from the very person, KKR, whose judgement you publicly question and ridicule. I’d say that bond was broken long ago…

                • To quote Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche on samaya, in his own words, “stranger things have been known to happen,” which was what Rinpoche told me in response to my concern about what I had read about the subject in question which I found to be at odds with who I am, my own man, to which Rinpoche added, whatever the future holds for us, and this is a direct quote, “we will never again be apart” as guru and disciple, notwithstanding all that I and anyone knowledgeable of the conventional knowledge available on the subject of samaya, as far as the Mahasiddha inspired crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu lineage is concerned I need not worry about him playing the samaya card with me, a commitment honored to this day by Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche despite the best efforts of people at KTD to convince him to do otherwise, so, yes, I have never trusted Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche’s judgement, with Rinpoche’s blessings I might add, he wouldn’t have it any other way, as it is for any lama who holds the Mahasiddha inspired crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu ineage, forever an oral lineage between guru and disciple, scripture be damned, whatever it takes, by whatever means necessary, enlightenment or bust, very long story short.

                  • karma

                    SHUNRYU SUZUKI probably framed what’s going on here better than me:
                    “Often we think what we have done is good, but it may not actually be so. When we become old, we are often very proud of what we have done. When others listen to someone proudly telling something which he has done, they will feel funny, because they know his recollection is one-sided. They know that what he has told them is not exactly what he did. Moreover, if he is proud of what he did, that pride will create some problem for him. Repeating his recollections in this way, his personality will be twisted more and more, until he becomes quite a disagreeable, stubborn fellow.”

                    • So says the outsider looking in to that which they cannot begin to fathom, I am a lama, I can say this without fear of contradiction, cast what shade on me you may but it takes nothing from the shade Ogyen Trinley Dorje that the Panama Papers has thrown up Ogyen Trinley Dorje’s future prospects as a teacher of Buddhism in the United States of America, just ask the Buddhists you know what they think Ogyen Trinley Dorje using the same law firm used by members of the Chinese Communist Party to hide funds he received from supporters of said dictatorship in an offshore account, mark my words, in the United States of America this is toxic for Ogyen Trinley Dorje, not that I don’t enjoy your driving traffic to this matter with your fixation over my being a lama, something beyond your understanding of ow someone becomes a lama in the Mahasiddha inspired crazy wisdom Karma Kagyu lineage I have dedicated my life to.

  9. What do the labels that we impose ourselves and have imposed upon us matter?

    I read a quote attributed to Trungpa Rinpoche, to paraphrase – if beginningless time and infinite rebirth are taken seriously, it seems logical to say that we all have taken the bodhisattva vows many times over. There is no reason not to think we are all precious gems…

    We each have a duty to examine the people we allow to be our teachers, despite a title.

    All that matters is if there is value … we each must determine with our own discernment, meaning we must ask the hard questions, hold our teachers accountable, and provide any assistance they may need in becoming more informed.

  10. Dharma friends,

    The hyperbole of fry was only meant to say that he would be finished for good. The evidence when examined is overwhelming. Our lethargy and indifference is also overwhelming when I read your comments. Bill is pointing out a major issue here. I personally know many people who support his ideas as fact. He is asking you. challenging you to dig deeper, read a bit, and ask a good question or two. Take this challenge fearlessly. The Buddha dharma is worth it. The Buddha dharma requires that we check this for the benefit of all.

    QP

      • Ashley Noel Schwartz

        Why are you being ever the blowhard, Billy?

        • To send Ogyen Trinley Dorje back to the people that made him the 17th Karmapa, the Chinese Communist Party, long story short, by driving traffic to this post so that in the event Ogyen Trinley Dorje attempts to visit the United States in the future when people google who he is they will read about how he was caught using the same law firm used by members of the Chinese Communist Party to hide money he has received from supporters of said dictatorship in an offshore account, which I have done by simply by stating the obvious, that I am a lama, and thus getting in the heads of the powers that be at KTD, I’m told that my doing so has become a topic of gossip in KTD’s cafeteria, if you really want to know, basically, the same thing I did with the banishment of Bardor Tulku narrative I created to undermine the confidence people at KTD have in the people calling the shots there and thus disrupt those who wish to use the Karma Kagyu lineage in the United States of America to normalize the Chinese Communist Party, a dictatorship, and its 17th Karmapa, Ogyen Trinley Dorje, so keep those comments coming all you haters out there, because I can’t do this without your support.

      • ha ha, at least we have a sence of humor

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