Does the present relationship between the 17th Karmapa and the apostasy of Jamgon Kongtrul represents a catastrophic failure on his part as a lineage holder?

I submit for your consideration that this, the 17th Karmapa’s relationship with the present Kalu and Jamgon Kongtrul Rinpoches, is not how an orally transmitted lineage works and that the fault is his.

On the up side the 17th Karmapa, as he should, blames himself.

What remains to be seen is what if anything the 17th Karmapa can do to mitigate the damage to our oral lineage as such.

Too bad the 17th Karmapa instead of giving Traleg Rinpoche’s reincarnation to us, Rinpoche was one of us, he effectively ended the Traleg succession when he gave the Chinese control of his successor.

Traleg Rinpoche’s successor as was the case with Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche’s successor will never follow in his predecessor’s footsteps, to have what the predecessors of both Rinpoches taught to us taught back to them, which is how an oral lineage is supposed to work.

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The present Kalu Rinpoche’s predecessor was the 16th Karmapa’s guru yet he himself in 2017 has no relationship with the 17th Karmapa…

In an oral lineage such as our Karma Kagyu as established here by the 16th Karmapa this cannot be so, it makes no sense to us, this is not how succession by reincarnation works, yet in the Karma Kagyu lineage of Tibetans no Tibetan dares question what for us is a catastrophic failure to maintain our oral lineage.

I was personally looking forward to how this particular relationship was going to work out given that Kalu Rinpoche’s predecessor out lived the 16th Karmapa, the guru out lived the disciple, which should have made for quite the interesting dynamic between the present Kalu Rinpoche and the 17th Karmapa as such.

In 2017 Kalu Rinpoche and the 17th Karmapa are not even on speaking terms.

Their samaya as guru and disciple has been broken and it was the 17th Karmapa as the previous Kalu Rinpoche’s disciple that violated said samaya in terms of how our oral lineage works.

The present Kalu Rinpoche is the reincarnation of the 17th Karmapa’s guru as such.

My guru Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche regarded the late Traleg Rinpoche as the reincarnation of his guru.

Quite literally, which made for a fascinating dynamic between the two men, a grown man bending a knee so to speak to a much younger man.

Vajradhara was in the house.

I submit the above as written for your consideration as yet another example of the fundamental difference which exists today between our Karma Kagyu, an oral lineage transmitted from guru to disciple, from generation to generation, and the Karma Kagyu lineage of Tibetans, today more Chinese than Tibetan with its sacred scriptures and ancestor worship which we today find ourselves so at odds with as Buddhists here today.

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A big win for the Shangpa Kagyu is a big loss for the Karma Kagyu lineage

I submit for your consideration the example of Kalu Rinpoche following in his predecessor’s footsteps.

Vajradhara is without question in the house.

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Are the “Six yogas of Naropa” a path of liberation or just an exercise in ancestor worship for Tibetans?

The “Six yogas of Naropa” is an exercise in ancestor worship for Tibetans.

If it was a path of liberation Tibetans  would be free.

The 16th Karmapa would never have had to flee the Chinese in 1959.

I submit the above as written for your consideration here.


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For an oral lineage such as the Karma Kagyu the apostasy of Jamgon Kongtrul the 4th is a catastrophic failure

Our Karma Kagyu lineage is an oral lineage, our practice guru yoga.

This is no longer the case for the Karma Kagyu lineage of Tibetans.

Just drill down into their 2017 Kagyu Monlam and see for yourself what these people are about.

Today’s Tibetan has taken their Karma Kagyu lineage in another, more Chinese friendly direction.

Ancestor worship.

Thus Jamgon Kongtrul the 4th’s apostasy changes nothing for Tibetans as such.

Whereas for us Jamgon Kongtrul the 4th’s apostasy is a catastrophic loss to our lineage.

Absent his presence in our lives our guru yoga has no guru as such.

First we lost Trungpa to the Chinese.

Then we lost Traleg to the Chinese.

And now this.

So much for the Karma Kagyu being an oral lineage.

It’s all scriptures and ancestor worship, at least if you are Tibetan it seems.

I submit the above as written for your consideration here.

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No wonder the 17th Karmapa is so angry and depressed 

So it will be that we will henceforth remember with each passing year’s Kagyu Monlam the time an angry and depressed 17th Karmapa confessed to us his loss of yet another line of Karma Kagyu reincarnations under his watch.

Kalu Rinpoche was lost thanks to his being raped while under the 17th Karmapas protection.

Let us never forget that the monks that raped Kalu Rinpoche for all we know attended the 17th Karmapa’s Kagyu Monlam prayer festival this year.

Kalu Rinpoche will never forget his rapists.

We lost Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche’s successor to the Chinese.

This was on Situ Rinpoche though, his revenge on Vajradhatu as such, the original Rolex Rinpoche in his role as the 17th Karmapa’s Regent.

Situ Rinpoche did this while the 17th Karmapa’s regent.

Losing Traleg Rinpoche’s successor to the Chinese was harder on us than Tibetans.

Traleg Rinpoche was one of us more than them.

And now we have lost Jamgon Kongtrul Rinpoche’s successor.

As if the last Jamgon Kongtrul Rinpoche’s suicide wasn’t enough for us to process.

All lost since the 16th Karmapa passed into Parinirvana here in 1981.

No wonder the 17th Karmapa is angry and depressed.

I submit the above as written for your consideration.

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Do all Tibetan Buddhists take money from the Chinese or is the Karma Kagyu lineage alone in this regard?

Since 2007 as documented by the Panama Papers last year the 17th Karmapa has been taking money from the very same people the 16th Karmapa fled in 1959 to pay for his Kagyu Monlam prayer festival.


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OTD’s Chinese “to get rich is glorious” funded 2017 Kagyu Monlam evokes Milarepa

I submit for your consideration “Reviving the tradition of the cotton-clad yogis” brought to you by OTD’s “to get rich is glorious” Chinese benefactors that have been paying for his annual Kagyu Monlam prayer festival since 2007 as documented by the Panama Papers last year.

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If the Karma Kagyu has been reduced as OTD confessed to scriptures, ancestor worship, and donations, what’s in it for us as Buddhists?

At this point we might as well call the Karma Kagyu lineage a school of Chinese Mahayana Buddhism and call it a day.

Tibetan exile bankrolled by wealthy Chinese.

The apostasy of a Tibetan Tulku.

And not a Tibetan questions any of it.

Incredible.

We all might as well be living in China.

The 16th Karmapa didn’t flee these people in 1959 to for this.

I submit the above as written for your consideration here.

Shut it down!

Shut it down!

Shut it down!

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Something happened between December 29, 2014 and April 12, 2016 in JKR4th’s life that we need to know more about

OTD needs to explain how JKR4th went from this:

“If you are attached to this life, you are not a dharma practitioner.”

JKR4th at OTD’s 2014 Kagyu Monlam

To this:

“Now I have reached a state where it is unbearable.”

JKR4th August 2, 2016 Facebook

OTD has some explaining to do here.

Shut it down!

Shut it down!

Shut it down!

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